Suggestions

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Suggestions for Shartak are always welcome, although there's no guarantee that anything will be added. Comments on or modifications for any of the suggestions below can be added by editing this page. Please be considerate and don't just remove ideas that you don't like.

Begin a new item with a * and "sign" your suggestions using -- ~~~~ so we know who to blame ;)

Bug reports should go on the Bugs page.

Contents

Skills

Planting/agriculture

Both outsiders and natives with this skill should be able to plant trees (mango, banana) on fertile land. By clearing away jungle, and applying an example of the fruit of the tree you wish to plant, you could sow the seed. A tree of that type would then sprout X days later. This would open up for plantation, and help feed the villages/settlements. --DKChannelboredom (2 March)

Interesting idea, perhaps only a chance that a tree will grow, and to ensure a tree grows you have to plant a certain number of fruit of the same kind on the same block. Of course, does this mean that existing trees should occasionally die off, say if they get surrounded by 8 blocks of highest density jungle and the tree block is also highest density jungle.. maybe explained as something to do with lack of sunlight reaching the tree because of the amount of jungle around it. --Simon 09:47, 2 March 2006 (GMT)

Weapon Skills

The Warrior/Soldiers class should get weapon skills, like spear skills for the warrior and rifle skills for the soldier, make the soldiers skills make the rifle have better to hit then the natives spear but the rifle requires the searching of ammo, this makes the difference between natives and outsiders warrior classes more than the blowpipe and rifle (blowpipes do 1 less damage) EDIT: I ahnotice that the outsiders do indeed have rifle training, freshly added to the wiki I guess.-- Daylan 11:07, 17 February 2006 (GMT)

We have been doing some research(see the talk page in character classes) and it appears that warriors are no better at fighting(unless you count 10 extra hp as being really great) than any other class, correct me if I'm wrong but if there is no warrior only fighting skill what makes them warriors and not shamans w/ blowpipes(pardon the pun but they "blow") and +10hp? and if that is all they are how come soilders get extra skills? -- Daylan 02:55, 3 March 2006 (GMT)

Tracking

Anyone with the Tracking skill should be able to track where people have gone, either generic "A native passed by here recently" or more specific "Average Joe left heading north 2 days ago".

Comments

  • Should probably be a timelimit so you don't see "Average Joe left heading north 90 days ago". - Snarf

Religious Devotion

Required to use "Holy Scriptures" --One of many doctors 23:22, 16 February 2006 (GMT)

Jungle Skills

The jungle environment has great potential to add significant dynamic to this game. These could be a set of skills to reflect this.

Jungle Lore: Player has x% chance of discovering item/artifact. Might work in conjunction with search skill.
Make/Detect Traps: Spikes, Pits etc... Not sure this is possible and what would be need to time degrade this.Nankilstlas
Some kind of "hiding" skill where you can spend AP to conceal yourself in fauna, so you can't be seen by passersby. Visually, it could take the form of "reforesting" a block to dark green, and someone who chops through would "uncover" you, perhaps getting some XP? --Jackel 19:34, 25 February 2006 (GMT)
A 'trapping' skill looks like it would be exploited by greifers (surrounding someone with traps, for example), but I like the 'Hiding' and 'Jungle Lore' ideas.--Grigoriy 02:26, 26 February 2006 (GMT)
The hiding skill shouldn't conceal you from animals or someone with the Sixth Sense, Exploration, or Jungle Lore skills, otherwise the player would be invincible.--Grigoriy 21:15, 27 February 2006 (GMT)
Agreed, hostile animals should be able to sniff out hidden players, and Sixth Sense makes sense as well. Hidden players have to remain motionless to stay hidden, using items, searching, etc, would "unhide" the person. I was also thinking how the "reforesting" aspect could be abused to create vast areas that needed to be chopped down, so maybe a player could only hide in an already dark green area, (getting a message like there is not enough foliage to suitable hide in when trying in a cleared area) limiting its effect somewhat, and creating a little extra tension when on the run from someone and trying to find an overgrown area to hide in. --Jackel 22:37, 27 February 2006 (GMT)

Skinning

This is a skill that does not have a pre-requisite. Upon coming across an area where a dead animal is present, the player is given an opportunity to skin the animal. The process of skinning costs 1 AP and has a chance of producing items such as Animal Hide or Animal Tooth or Animal Feathers. These items can be traded to an NPC found in villages and exchanged for Gold Coins. This skill should be available to all classes to grant them all with an equal opportunity of earning Gold. --Lint 21:48, 23 February 2006 (GMT)

  • Extend skinning to killed players? No, that's just wrong. We are civilized. *puffs pipe* - Lint
  • Make skinning have a pre-requisite of Exploration? Perhaps. *puffs pipe* - Lint
  • Make skinning always produce an item, rather than chance? No, I like a good challenge. *puffs pipe* - Lint
  • Perhaps it could be tied to the Meat suggestion? *shrugs* *puffs pipe* - Lint
  • Good idea, perhaps natives don't have a pre-requisite, but outsiders need exploration? *cough* --Grigoriy 02:12, 26 February 2006 (GMT)
    • While that may be a more realistic way to handle it - since natives would conceivably be more experienced with such matters - I think that changing the skill tree for such a minor skill would upset the general sense of game balance between the two sides. --Lint 02:43, 26 February 2006 (GMT)

Animal Spirit

(native only) Upon gaining this skill, an animal type is associated with the player. Any attacks by the player on that animal result in negative xp, but the animal is less likely to attack the player. Additionally, if the player dons the skin of the animal (perhaps via the Skinning skill) then a bonus is given to the player, such as faster movement, hit bonus, damage bonus. Bonus could be dependant on animal. Upon player death, there is a chance the player's animal spirit will change. --frisco

Build Training

(Outsiders only) They gain the ability to build walls around the outsider settlements. There would be different levels like reinforced, light, massive, etc. Whoever can attack them and destroy them. Maybe there would be a skill for building gates? --One of many doctors 03:33, 1 March 2006 (GMT)

  • Natives should be able to make walls too - think King Kong, plus if there are native ruins on this island, then they must still have some decent construction knowledge lingering around. However, Outsiders should have an "Advanced" skill that allows for stronger walls. --Frisco 04:41, 1 March 2006 (GMT)
Yes, any human should be able to build, and they should ONLY be able to build in certain areas, so as not to have some group lay claim to a section of the island with key resources (assuming there are some). Also, it should take a LOT of AP. --Jackel 00:18, 2 March 2006 (GMT)

Trap Laying

(Native only) They can place one time use traps that dmg outsiders only. This skill can only be used in the jungle. Maybe a skill to be able to detect traps? --One of many doctors 03:36, 1 March 2006 (GMT)


  • Again i'm thinking Outsiders could make traps too - some of them must have been hunters in the Old Country - but perhaps an Advanced skill for natives, leading to higher success rate, since they are more used to the environment. This skill seems dangerous, though, possibly leading to clans just laying traps in every single square of jungle, making it ridiculous for the other side. Perhaps a trap can only be made in certain jungle types, and only lasts until the jungle changes in level (either growing up naturally or down by the same character type chopping it). --Frisco 04:53, 1 March 2006 (GMT)
This was already proposed in the "jungle skills" section. I agree, it seem too easy to abuse by griefers.--Jackel 00:18, 2 March 2006 (GMT)

Items

Spear

It could be the native warriors main weapon, give it a base damage of 3, same to hit as machete but it wouldn't cut through jungle -- Daylan 11:02, 17 February 2006 (GMT)

A spear for stabbing or a spear for throwing (i.e single use) ? --Simon 15:49, 25 February 2006 (GMT)

Head-shrinking powder

This could be either a melee or area weapon used by natives.

Comments

  • What are the effects of it? Causes X HP of damage? Loss of AP? Loss of XP? Instant death? - Snarf

Meat

Heals 2 HP. Used by both outsiders and tribals. It appears in your inventory when you kill a beastie. Bungalow Bill

  • But you can only carry 200 pounds of meat back to your wagon. </oregontrail> --Lint 01:15, 13 February 2006 (GMT)
  • Or you have to cook it, taking one AP and possibly a fire-lighting skill (who wants to eat raw monkey?).MorkaisChosen 20:12, 20 February 2006 (GMT)
    • Maybe you don't have to cook it but you get less HP and possibly lose HP to food poisoning. [DarkFerret]
  • Or, to make it more, hm, tribal, you could need to bring it back to specific places in the village where it could be (instantaneously) cooked and used as a replenished "health pool" any player could use. You would still have the occasional berries to eat in the forest, but real meal would occure at a settlement. It would also provide a more efficient healing system (as currently, you roughly get to spend 50 AP to recover 4 or 5 HP, which makes death the most efficient way to restore your HP). -- Leaf
    • There is a large pot of stew cooking, it appears to be half full.

You eat some and feel better. After a few spoonfuls you find your friend's pocket watch. [DarkFerret]

Radio beacon/receiver

A radio beacon/receiver for outsiders to pinpoint specific locations of interest.

Comments

  • What's wrong with using the GPS co-ordinates of a specific location? - Snarf
  • Perhaps a way to have GPS waypoints or markers IN one own's GPS? --Wcervantes 19:39, 16 February 2006 (GMT)

Holy Scriptures

Used to convert Natives into Ousiders. Requires "Religious Devotion". Most likely found around Outsider settlements --One of many doctors 23:22, 16 February 2006 (GMT)

  • Nobody wants to have a class change againt their will. -Grigoriy
  • Noone wants to die against their will either, but it does happen ;-) Might be irritating, but also might be quite interesting. It would have to be possible both ways of course, natives to outsiders and outsiders to natives. Perhaps the outsiders can convert natives to outsiders with holy scriptures using the religious devotion skill and natives can convert outsiders to natives with a bottle of beer using the seduction skill! ;-) --Murk 12:28, 4 March 2006 (GMT)

GPS Unit (Redesign)

This is a suggestion to change the gps unit into an object that presumably fits better with the game setting. We currently have no other modern item available for use (anachronism - VOCABULARY WORD!). Perhaps we should use a sextant? And rather than reveal the position all of the time, it requires a 1 AP use in non-dense, non-enclosed area. --Lint 21:48, 23 February 2006 (GMT)

  • Yes, GPS units are indeed malapropos (another vocabulary word :D)--Grigoriy 00:33, 27 February 2006 (GMT)

Refillable containers

Does it really make sense that after drinking something, you automatically discard the container it had been in? I propose a modification to the inventory system so bottles/gourds work similar to rifles and blowguns--they can be refilled if they are empty. Obviously, you can't just carry around spare water like you can ammo, so to refill a water container, you have to be in water. This would clearly make areas near water more popular, which I don't think is a bad thing, or without precedent. Furthermore, this could lead to new and interesting directions, such as other liquids that could be carried around, causing various effects. Off the top of my head:

drinking too much "ocean" water will make you sick (reducing your hit % temporarily)
a "create mysterious serum" skill the shaman/scientist can eventually learn that (along with certain ingredients) lets them create a "buff" potion.
special healing water springs that have double the recuperative effect

This would also address one of the concerns I've had regarding healing skills. To my knowledge, there is no place in Shartak where you are more likely to consistantly find healing kits/herbs, etc. its all fairly random. By comparision, UD has certain buildings where you can only find certain items (i.e. hospitals = first aid kits). IMO, its currently too difficult/AP consuming to heal. Without a way to consistantly find/create healing items, it's not likely there will be "healers" willing to use their hard-to-find healing items on anyone else. --Jackel 22:14, 25 February 2006 (GMT)

Have you found the hut in Dalpok with all the drying herbs hanging up? Says something about a shaman being busy, I seem to have a reasonable success rate at finding healing herbs there. Not sure if there are more around. --Snarf 22:17, 25 February 2006 (GMT)
No, I hadn't noticed such a hut(s), I've assumed they were all pretty much the same. If certain huts are more likely to contain certain items, I've another suggestion--label them. Any opinion on my primary suggestion of refillable containers? --Jackel 22:31, 25 February 2006 (GMT)

Other

Supplies in settlements

Could there perhaps be some kind of a more reliable way to get things in villages, apart from randomly finding them? Coming across abandoned items in jungles, evaquated police departments and such makes sense, but going on an epic quest for a machete under someone's carpet in an active village just seems a bit out of place.

So, if it's not too much of a hassle, which it most likely is, I suggest there to perhaps be put some kind of trader characters in settlements, who could exchange all kindsa things for random junk you've found lying around in other places, or maybe you could get these fellas to make items for you free of charge, which you could go and pick up after a period of time?

..probably too complicated for something that's rather useless. Oh well. --Ismo Kuikka

There's a trading post in one of the huts in Dalpok, can't get anything there though. Perhaps a sign of things to come? --Snarf 10:33, 17 February 2006 (GMT)

Tunnels

Tunnels underneath the island lead to interesting places.

How do you know they don't exist? :) Dr. J

Treasure to capture

"Capture the flag" type objective, in this case the flags are treasure from each village. Bonus points in the form of XP or gold coins to be awarded to the holder of the treasure at certain intervals.

Writing on the tree (or sand)

Should be able to write stuff in the sand on the beaches and carve short messages into trees in the jungle. To avoid "carve-wars" the only way to get rid of messages on trees could be to chop the jungle down and wait for it to grow again before you can write a new message. -- Snarf 22:32, 27 January 2006 (GMT)

FYI, currently working on this. --Simon 23:16, 20 February 2006 (GMT)
Done. Watch out for quirks depending on where you're writing. --Simon 15:24, 27 February 2006 (GMT)

Informational messages

You should be able to see what other people have done since your past turn. Much like the skill above, except for most actions that take place. Such as '[09:34]Joe used a medkit on Roger' or '[05:23]Dan Attacked a Boar and missed'. If this is implemented, there should be a menu that you can use to toggle certain bits of information, to reduce or stop spam. Durja 18:14, 6 February 2006 (GMT)

Comments

I don't want to see when people miss attacks, that's just too much information (unless it's me that they're attacking!) - Snarf
Would be useful to see when kills are made in the same location eg. Dan killed a boar or Joe killed Roger - Snarf
How about making a list of "informational messages" that might be required? - Snarf
  • PlayerX killed PlayerY.
  • PlayerX killed animal.
  • PlayerY died from eating some poisonous berries. (self-inflicted death)

Player VS Player Interaction

I would propoese a to hit % penalty for attacking members of same Home location. I believe this will promote exploration and perhaps offer a measure of protection of newly "birthed" population. As a recent victim of death by the hands of a warrior from my own villiage this has a bit of appeal to me ;). - Nan

Instead of a hit % penalty, what about reducing or eliminating XP earned for such attacks? It would be similar to the ZvZ penalty used in UrbanDead, and its easier to rationalize not getting as much experience fighting one of your own than to rationalize that its harder to hit your own people for some reason. --Jackel 19:52, 27 February 2006 (GMT)

Classes

Priest

Starts off with a "Holy Scripture" and the "Religious Devotion Skill". --One of many doctors 23:22, 16 February 2006 (GMT)

None of the other classes start with a skill. I think they should just have access to the skill, and maybe stuff like scientists don't (I'm not saying all scientists are unreligious, just that there probably aren't any THAT religious!). MorkaisChosen 11:06, 17 February 2006 (GMT)

Scientist (Rename)

This is a suggestion to change the name of the Scientist class to Professor. From Tarzan to Gilligan's Island, the science-type in has been regarded as Professor rather than Scientist. --Lint 21:48, 23 February 2006 (GMT)

I don't. If someone wants to roleplay as a scholarly Prof, more power to them. As it is, the term "Scientist" suggests a broader archetype, inviting players to make of their character what they will. which I favor. --Jackel 23:56, 3 March 2006 (GMT)

Villager/Settler

Lint recently made a very salient point with respect to Class Balance. Namely, there are very few players (4% currently) choosing to be (Outsider) Settlers or (Native) Villagers. Realistically, these should be the most abundant classes, so clearly (aside from trival starting inventory) these classes clearly lack any definable appeal. I propose that these 2 classes (due to their years of plying and scavenging their surroundings) are more adept at searching then their peers. As such, they have a +20% bonus in base search percentage. There is precedent for this in UD, with the "consumer" class getting an immediate advantage in searching, and though the nature of that game (i.e. constant heavy barricading of Malls) makes it difficult for consumers to realize their advantage, this would not be the case in Shartak. This change will undoubtedly make these overlooked classes more attractive to new players.--Jackel 00:25, 4 March 2006 (GMT)

Animal

It would be interesting to play as an animal. They wouldn't be able to use some items or learn certain skills, but they could smell the trails of humans and other animals. Some could eat vegetation, an action similar to choping, and restore HP. --Darkferret 18:24, 4 March 2006 (GMT)

Pirate

Every tropical island needs pirates! Could either be Outsider or a separate grouping altogether (current pirates being more native than foreign, from the news i read). Don't know what special skills they have, maybe better at finding gold in towns, or general stuff on the beach, and any parrots they encounter follow them around (perhaps monkeys too). If agriculture is implemented, they get to grow weed and poppy. Maybe they'd be better as the Outsider NPC counterpart to NPC shamans, and raid towns every so often. --Frisco 04:14, 5 March 2006 (GMT)

I have no idea how we could implement them into Shartak, but I do like pirates... --Grigoriy 05:29, 5 March 2006 (GMT)

Game Mechanics

Conversion

When an Outsider/Native dies they are reborn as a Native (don't really understand the spirit thing too well). The Outsiders then get a new class/skill, "Religious Conversion" that requires a "Holy Scripture". This allows a "Priest" to convert one native into a Outsider". The converted native would most likely start off as a Settler. --One of many doctors 23:22, 16 February 2006 (GMT)

  • I believe that Natives are reborn as Natives and Outsiders are reborn as Outsiders, but I could be wrong. From a game balance perspective, I am not in favor of type-swapping skills unless Natives are presented with an ability to counter or convert Outsiders as well. It does fit nicely with the theme though. --Lint 23:41, 16 February 2006 (GMT)
  • That would probably be the shamans job, however it may have worked for Urban Dead but I don't think it will work in this game as whichever group has the most players to begin with will, once conflicts begin to arise, dominate by switching people from the side they are on the side the priest/"whatever the natives use" side making you able to graph one groups population by looking at the graph pop=(1/2)^x. Also since there wouldn't seem to be a way, short of finding a converter player to switch you back, to go back to playing as you once did would make the amount of people on one side quickly die off (even though thats what would happen in real life, favouring the outsiders) it would be a very unfun aspect of the game. And really these are HOSTILE natives, or so it seems, why would they let some devilman outsider tell it how it is? They wouldn't, they would simply spear them and laugh! In short all the converting ideas suck, I know I wouldn't want to log on to find I'm playing for the wrong side. -- Daylan 10:55, 17 February 2006 (GMT)
  • So that means if my soldier dies, he's reborn as a native? Not only that, but to become an outsider again, first I would have to find a priest (which would be next to impossible with such a small number of players), and then he could convert me into a settler. That means I'll never be able to be a soldier again, which is a real punch in the throat for RPers. -- Grigoriy
  • All valid points. I guess this wouldn't really work we have the same number of players as Urban Dead. But this would be a great way to balance out the sides later on. Say there are too many natives, you just drop more "conversion items" and balance out the sides. Too many Outsiders? Just drop the number of conversion items. Doubt it would catch on though. --One of many doctors 02:44, 19 February 2006 (GMT)
  • Conversion doesn't have to be forced. It could require action on both sides, like a native doning a religious item and an outsider using the skill on that native. After all, conversion isn't real without true faith. The native counter to this could be similar, requiring an outsider to die holding a packet of that headshrinking powder while a shaman uses the Zombification (ala Haitian witchcraft) skill. -- frisco
  • You don't change class or anything when you die. --Murk 12:31, 4 March 2006 (GMT)

Capturing villages

Since this is like some war between Outsiders and Natives I thought this appropriate. If all the (say) Outsiders are killed in York and there are none left, then it becomes a Native village and vice versa. Probably needs harder requirements to capture settlements though. Maybe each side could have one permanent place that can never change hands? --One of many doctors 03:41, 1 March 2006 (GMT)

Not sure about this - what about all the idle players within the village? They might "wake up" after a couple of weeks to find they're in enemy territory. --Simon 11:00, 1 March 2006 (GMT)
You could have it so idle players goto the nearest friendly village-- Daylan 02:58, 3 March 2006 (GMT)
Turf control in a limited AP browser game like this just invites lame zerging behavior. I don't like it. --Jackel 00:00, 4 March 2006 (GMT)
Not villages, perhaps 3x3 square 'forts'? --Grigoriy 01:10, 4 March 2006 (GMT)

Unique skills

I think that each class should start off with one unique skill that the others may never aquire. That way it stops all the classes from becoming too generic. For example Settlers could have a "farming" skill, Soldiers could have a "bravery" skill, etc. Or mabey they could just have a attribute like Soldiers have an extra 10% chance of striking the target, Warriors have an extra 10% chance of finding animals, Settlers have an extra 10% chance of finding an item, Scouts have a 3% chance of recovering 1 HP per AP spent, etc. --One of many doctors 02:34, 5 March 2006 (GMT)

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